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Views expressed by Sleep Talkin' Man rarely reflect the opinions of waking Adam.
Especially the desire to exterminate all vegetarians (but he does hate lentils.)

20100924

Sep 24 2010

"I know it's early, but I simply have got to let him know that if Santa doesn't bring me my X-Box, he's a dead fucking fat cunt."

 or click here
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Karen's notes: Should I bother to point out here that Adam and I are Jewish?

A reminder that I haven't put out there in a while: the "c word" is a bit different here. Although it is a really profane term, it is not nearly as shocking and taboo as it is in the States (I belive this is because it is used as an insult to men, rather than to women). I know some Brits will disagree but, believe me, in the States it's an absolute jaw-dropper.


69 comments:

  1. LMFAO!!!

    That is just brilliant!
    I sooooooooooooo needed that!

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  2. A friend of mine who happens to be Jewish, talks about "Hanukkah Harry", who leaves presents. I guess when she was younger she wanted Santa and her parents came up with him. Maybe Adam is talking to Hanukkah Harry!

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  3. hmm, new information, while you and adam are jewish, STM is not??

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  4. the 'c word' has a long history in England: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gropecunt_Lane
    :-D

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  5. I was in the United States Navy. Nothing offends me except racial slurs. THOSE bug the fuck out of me!

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  6. Re the 'C' word, it now appears fairly regularly on British TV, albeit bleeped out. It's still left very obvious what word is being used (last week I saw the comedian Jimmy Carr refer to the British Prime Minister's Director of Communications as a c*** on the TV show '8 out of 10 Cats'). I imagine that anything similar in the US - land of the 'wardrobe malfunction' - would ignite a bit of a storm, to say the least.

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  7. Althought the "C word" is without doubt one of the most shocking swear words, I think bad language generally is less taboo in the UK, or at least a larger proportion of the population are less offended by it and as such is more accepted.

    I remember watching "censored" versions of movies (such as Robocop) from the USA that kept pretty much everything in, but dubbed the swearing, switching "Asshole" for "Airhead" for example!

    Recently Bruce Willis was in the UK promoting his latest movie, and was concerned that the host (Jonathan Ross) had shown the movie to his children, not because of the violence, blood and killing, but because of the "cussing". Any thoughts from our US friends?!

    By the way, love the blog, and I have the pirates mouspad!!!

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  8. There are a lot of people in the US who take cursing very seriously. I do not happen to be one of those fucking people.

    griffinrose: 'Hanukkah Harry' was an old Saturday Night Live character, played by Jon Lovitz. On a related note, my mother once made up a character called The Craaaazy Latke that she claimed would bring us our gifts for Hanukkah.

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  9. swearing or cussing in my neck of the New England woods is very gauche. It's a sign that you weren't raised right. My mother always said, the people who swear won't really notice that you don't, but the people who don't will definitely notice you do, and judge you by it. I know it's a BIG judgement thing here in the USA. The quiet side of discrimination, I guess. Or not so quiet if you are the swear-er!

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  10. addendum to above: When I DO swear, people who know me understand that I am way beyond pissed off, and tend to leave me alone or change their behavior. So not swearing has a nice payoff sometimes. And that's just with the little words like shit. If I ever used the word cunt, I think my family would faint or have the men in the white coats come take me away!

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  11. Here in the States, the "C-word" (I can't even bring myself to type it) is the absolute lowest of insults. It is always directed toward women, never men. I admit to be fairly loose with my language and that is one I would never say.

    On a side note- I love the old "Hannukah Harry" bit from SNL!

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  12. Och! This is absolutely priceless!

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  13. I was raised with ZERO swearing. You couldn't even say "Awww MAN" or "Rats!"

    Then I entered the real world, and quickly picked up an array of cusswords to make a sailor blush.

    Funny though - if you put me around older people (my grandparents' age, 70+ now) I automatically don't swear. It's not even conscious refraining on my part - it just doesn't even come out of my mouth.

    @RySPikes... I let my kids watch movies with cussing in them over kids TV shows where the kids are smart ass and disrespectful. I once got raked over the coals because my nine year old was watching Alien with her dad. A visitor said "But it is so violent and scary and has the 'F' word in it!!"

    I said, "Hey - my kids know better then to use the F word - they'll get their mouths washed out. They know the violence and scary monsters aren't real. My problem is stupid teenybopper shows on Nickelodeon that have kids talking smack to their mom. THAT seems real, and they pick that up a lot faster. My kid says 'Talk to the hand" to me, and their BOTTOM gonna be talking to my hand!"

    My visitor got horribly offended at me and stalked out. LOL! I wonder what she'd say if she knew I let my kids watch Dr Horrible... it has the word 'penis' in it. I'm sure my kids are doomed.

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  14. I've always found it remarkably sexist that Americans drop Dick, Prick and Cock at the drop of a baseball hat but the equivelent words for the female anatomy were too horrible to mention.

    And of course Cunt has a long history in the UK the word is Anglo-Saxon, Chaucer used it. How can it be bad language when Chaucer used it? :)

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  15. I think it's very interesting as a person from a non english speaking country to read about the effect the C-word has. From my p.o.w. that word doesn't seem that bad. But I guess it's a cultural thing.

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  16. This is an interesting discussion, thanks STM. The comment about people who swear don't notice the people who don't is not 100 percent true. I was not one to cuss in the workplace, then one day I dropped the "F" bomb, and everone's jaw dropped.

    I think it's fascinating that STM and Adam appear to be 2 seperate identities, to the point of different religions as well! Crazy!! lol

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  17. I'm from Holland.
    The magic word is context. I'm not easily offended. If someone loses his cool, it's his loss really and if swearing helps someone to speak his mind then I support that. It takes all kinds. Formalities for formality's sake mean two things: Jack and Shit. And Jack just left town.

    But there are some words here (many of the minor swear words are similar to those in the States) that manage to shock most people. Of which the most common is the use of cancer as a swearword. I know what it looks like. It's not something you should wish for someone. We pronounce it with hard K's rather than C's so I imagine it feels the same as exclaiming 'wanker'.

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  18. As a properly raised New Englander I, also, was admonished about swearing and not being raised right. We were also told that it was a form of laziness and that people who swore weren't intelligent enough to find other words to express themselves.

    As an adult I have enjoyed the release a good swear brings although I do wince when I hear very small children swearing. After attending The Vagina Monologues I learned to fully embrace the C word without embarassment and have used it, appropriately, on occasion because there are just some women who deserve it.

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  19. I recently read a study that showed that when people are under great stress or performing some kind of demanding physical exercise, swearing actually helps them get through it and perform better. I know I've used a dirty word or two (usually starting with "F" and ending with "uck") in a few spin classes and once crossing a very large lake in high winds paddling a canoe, and it's made me feel better! Still, I can't bring myself to say or hear the "c" word. I know it's totally cultural, so I try not to cringe too hard when we're watching British shows and it comes up. I think the use and connotation of curses makes for a really interesting cultural disucssion. Thanks for bringing it up!

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  20. Well I'm really offended. I may never visit the blog again. No, not because of the word "cunt". But because STM would want an XBox instead of a PS3! Haha

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  21. to anonymous at 13:58 (oh this is so european, military time too :)) Chaucer used the C word? In what context? The wife of bath maybe? I'm curious!

    Yes, it's a harsh word here in the states. I tend towards the f-bombs when frustrated, but I've learned to curb amost swearing since having a kid. The only time it pops out is in traffic, that's when I really need to watch it!

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  22. Actually, cunt is often used in the US as a term belittling men. Like pussy, it is another way to insult a man by insinuating he is a woman. When it is used for women, it is used to insinuate that the woman is nothing more than her genitalia.

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  23. When I lived in California, I once said the word 'bugger' and about 4 people nearly punched me in the face. Good thing I didn't say cunt! This is the funniest blog I've read in about 3 years. STM needs his own sleeping-chat show!

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  24. Raised on PA-NY border, which has a lot in common with New England. Also my mom was extremely religious. Dad is a champion at swearing. I don't swear much but I am known to deploy to offend, for effect, or for fun but only with someone with whom I am very close and who understands that swearing is not my typical nature. My husband was raised in a well-to-do Philadelphia suburb and he also rarely swears.

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  25. AHHH an X-Box fan! Sleep Talkin' Man just went up several pegs in my book!

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  26. "Actually, cunt is often used in the US as a term belittling men. Like pussy, it is another way to insult a man by insinuating he is a woman. When it is used for women, it is used to insinuate that the woman is nothing more than her genitalia. "

    Don't know what part of the US you've been living in, but for the past 20 years or better, on the extraordinarily rare occasion that I drop the "c" word, it is in reference to a woman...and not to imply that she is nothing more than her genitalia. It's the worst insult I, as a woman, can possibly hurl at another woman, and if I use it (which I have less than a dozen times in 20 years), I'm not referring to anatomy. I've also never used it, nor heard it used in the US, to refer to a male.

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  27. banana: Chaucer uses the word 'cunt' in The Miller's Tale. Alisoun is the wife of the miller, and is lusted after by their paying houseguest. He grabs her by her 'queynte' to seduce her. Quite forward in his approach, but it does work!

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  28. Apparently Canadians are the worst of the lot:
    http://www.visioncritical.com/2010/08/canadians-swear-more-often-than-americans-and-britons/

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  29. Re: Karen's notes

    Why would that matter? Is Santa Christian? lol I don't think so.

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  30. This is a fascinating discussion.

    I was raised in a household where people didn't swear---not because it was forbidden (in fact, I can't remember ever being told not to say a particular word) but because my parents just...didn't swear. They do now, from time to time, but usually only under great stress. At any rate, I didn't learn what most swear words were until I was in sixth or seventh grade, and I had never even heard the word "cunt" until I was a sophomore in high school---and even then, it was in the context of explaining the so-called "smuttiest joke in Shakespeare". It didn't even sound like a bad word to me, and I distinctly remember feigning comprehension at the time and then going home and looking it up.

    What is interesting is to examine my own reaction to this word, because I can look at it two different ways. The child in me sees nothing wrong with it because it's just a bunch of letters strung together to create a sound. I probably view it this way because I learned it from a dictionary, rather than from it being used as a swear word. The adult part of me---the part that understands that "this is the lowest word in the English language and should never, ever be used"---cringes at it. My reaction simply depends on which viewpoint I happen to be inhabiting more at the time.

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  31. @Charles talking about when you said bugger... really?!?! I use that when I don't want to swear! I sometimes use Bollocks.

    We weren't allowed to swear when we were growing up, not really anything other than dick, but then, my dad's called Richard, and mum sometimes called him Dick, so you know...

    As for cunt I use it, and I don't mind the word, but there's another word that I don't even like to spell, never mind say. I think it's really just because of the harsh sounding k in the middle of the word! wa...r

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  32. Thanks Anon at 17:04! I learn something new every day. Interesting spelling. Is the miller's tale the really bawdy one where she sticks her butt out the window pretending it's her face, and her (closed-eyed) suitor is surprised to find she's grown a beard? heee that one always cracked me up.

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  33. I have often explained my favor for the word cunt as it really is one the last universal and truly offensive word in the US language. The "N-word" is very socially hot and offensive, but it only refers to a particular population. I have used the word cunt in reference to men and women and it is always taken offensively. Not just by the intended but also by ANYONE listening. There are times when that effect is exactly what is called for.
    As for children, my mother agreed that people who use excessive profanity are either stupid or lazy. The rule in our house was you could use profanity when relevant, say like dropping a heavy item on your foot... If you used in a way she felt was not relevant you had to write out five to ten other things you could have said to make the same point. This worked for us. I never became a sailor, but don't avoid profanity when it often is exactly what I want to say.

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  34. I have a filthy mouth but was raised in a non-cursing environment. I know who I can and should not curse around. It is considered mannerly and civilized to refrain from foul language and lewd comments.

    @grace alexander - I know exactly what you mean about the kid/teen shows today. The kids rule the house and the parents are idiots. Where's the respect?

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  35. I'm a Yank, and I frequently use the word cunt. The only cuss word I use more frequently is the oh so versatile "fuck." When I do use the word cunt, it can be for either a man or a woman, but I do frequently use it to refer to a woman with loose morals. However, when I can't think of anything better to call someone, cunt is my default insult for just about anybody. Of course I do try to keep the cussing down around friends that I know it would offend. I am guessing that Emma's British and the word she doesn't want to type is wanker. Most of us Americans don't even know what that word means. Our closest equivalent is jerk-off. And X-Box's fpses beat PlayStation's rpgs any day.

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  36. C is the one word I object to. I have no problem that you quoted it from his sleep talking though. I absolutely know what a wanker is and would rather not use it because it offends Brits.

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  37. kimberj: Not many Brits that I know would be offended by this word unless used in a directly aggressive manner but even then it's vaguely comical. Some replies might even be along the lines of: "yes,...and?".
    I love it when you folks say "wanker", it sounds so odd coming from an American's mouth!

    CM

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  38. I'm a teenager so maybe its a generational thing but I don't find "cunt" that offensive at all. Sure, its not a word you should be throwing around a lot, but its no worse than dick or fucker.

    I live in Florida and in my family, cussing is a regular occurence. Both my parents curse wildly after they sneeze and my uncles and aunts drop bad words like there's no tomorrow.

    In my experience, hearing all the cuss words let me know that they existed and really weren't that important with their frequency. It was never really a big deal in my house and no one is thought of as unintelligent if they cuss. Its a personal choice and has nothing to do with brain power.

    My family never made a big deal about it so I never made a big deal about it. It just didn't seem worth it.

    As to those "teenybopper shows", it should be the same with cussing. Some of those shows are pretty funny and if your kids know not to say fuck then they should what is and is not a polite and respectful thing to say to adults. Use positive reinforcement rather than negative.
    Nothing makes a child angrier and more rebellious than being yelled at.

    And nothing's wrong with a little sarcasm. Please don't suck your child of a sense of humor.

    (Oh and also I've known what penis meant since I was four. My family promoted using proper terms. Again, not a huge deal.)

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  39. I'm from the U.S. and cussing is so taboo it's not funny. I want to move to Europe. Lol. My boyfriend and I call each other cunts all the time. We don't care one bit.

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  40. I remember seeing a great interview with Stephen Fry, a man I'm sure we'd all agree is extremely intelligent, discussing the joys of swearing! He thinks swearing is fantastic fun, and not a sign of stupidity in the slightest. I totally agree. Sure, I think language should be respectfully curbed in public in case there are sensitive ears around, but in the right context there's often nothing better than a good bit of swearing. Especially the ones that are fun to say- wanker and bollocks being particularly good ones, in my opinion!

    Here's the interview, if anyone was interested http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_osQvkeNRM

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  41. I grew up in New Jersey, and my parents immigrated from Cuba/Jamaica. Cussing is NOT tolerated. At all! My dad didn't even let us say "that sucks". We are 23/21/18 years old and we still don't cuss around my dad. My mom is a little bit less strict but she has a limit and gets really angry if it's surpassed.

    Also, our friends can't cuss around my parents or else they give us looks that basically translate as "why are you hanging around with that low-life".

    It's definitely a cultural thing. They we're raised in strict households in their countries.

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  42. Drmgiver, as "Santa" means saint, ie canonised by the Christian church, I guess yes it does mean he's a Christian figure... at least originally.

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  43. Wow, I never realised Americans held swearing in such taboo! I have never in my life met anyone who doesn't swear, or who is remotely offended by swearing, unless they were older than about 60. (not sure what happened to cause such an abrupt change in opinion a few generations ago!)

    In the North-East of England, "cunt" is used just to mean "thingy"
    I've heard "pass me that cunt" in pubs and bars with all ages in, and nobody batted an eyelid.

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  44. @ anonymous - RE: teenybopper shows - it's the subliminal attitudes I don't care for - not the actual terminology as much. Alien is a completely fantastical movie;the teen and preteen shows pretend to portray real life, which subtly influences. It's totally different.

    My children have perfectly good senses of humour, thanks, and I don't see where in my post I said I yelled at them. Jaysus.

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  45. @Drmgiver: Santa is ultimately derived from St. Nicholas, a legitimate Catholic saint - but he's been so secularized, and intermixed with various pagan traditions, that it makes no odds.....

    It seems a testament to the spread of American commercial culture, that Brits are referring to 'Santa' instead of 'Father Christmas'....... 7@=e

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  46. Oh yes, most Americans won't say shit if their mouths were full of it and when they do swear it's usually with very little flare but oh so very much ire.

    The few times I've been to the states I've noticed it is far more common to get customer service blindly saying the most polite things with horrible tones of 'please kill me' boredom.... but in swear happy Canada far more likely to get some eye-wateringly rude things said but in a really friendly engaging sort of way.

    *shrugs* I prefer it the Canadian way, if you find this at odds with our super polite stereotype... just remember, we're only rude to people we like. (and we might not know you yet....)

    Oh yes, and to all the Americans down there... stop calling me Ma'am! I don't care what your mother taught you, it is not needful, polite or even nice to end ever sentence by pointing out that you know my gender. If anything it is belittling and sexist. *grins* How's THAT for culture clash?

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  47. The word cunt definately is not as bad in the UK as anywhere else. I once saw my mother shouting at someone, calling them 'fucking useless cunt' after they blocked the ambulance she was driving! The only time i can remember offending someone with profanity was when i crushed my wrist at work and blurted out 'oh fucking bastard Jesus cock'.
    Didnt think bastard would offend!

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  48. My parents raised me not to curse, but that didn't stop me. I was a very belligerent little girl. My grade school teachers would tell my mother that I 'swore like a sailor', and I got in a lot of trouble. It didn't help that my parents had a hard time not cursing around my brother and me, and after a certain point they pretty much gave up, seeing as I'd heard it all already.

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  49. I totally agree with Anonymous @ 04.3!
    As a British female I'd be far more insulted if someone called me ma'am than if they called me a cunt!

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  50. "If Santa doesn't bring me my X-Box, he's a dead fucking fat cunt."

    Good Xmas Shirt, especially if you could replace X-Box with your present of choice:

    Plasma TV
    Superbowl Tickets
    Engagement Ring
    Porsche
    Caribbean Cruise
    Trip to Hawaii
    Label Maker
    etc.

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  51. about 20 years ago, I had a friend who used the C word till it stopped shocking me. then he taught me that using against a man, in a fight, is an automatic win because (in the US) there is no come-back, and a guy doesn't know what to do when a woman uses the worst insult he knows.

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  52. "Wanker" can even be used as a sort of ironic term of endearment (particularly by Australians?), but is decidedly post-TV-watershed language, in spite of its occasional misguided appearances on the Simpsons.

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  53. @ Sabre - Maybe its generational?

    I'm a college aged guy and my friends use cunt as a way to call each other gay (not that they are gay, just as an insult)and for cheap women. Its like saying something that needs to be fucked. Urban dictionary tends to agree: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=cunt

    We use it, but its definitely bad. I wouldnt say it in public.

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  54. PA-NY border person: It's strange how close people can be raised and be so different. I live in NE Philly, and my Lord the things I heard before the age of 10 just on the streets. And my neighborhood ain't exactly Skid Row! But my friends from the 'burbs NEVER curse. What a difference a 20-minute drive makes! Lol

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  55. 4:31 & 16:05 Should we call you "Sir" then? That really makes no sense......... You wankers! lol

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  56. isn't wanker the equivalent of calling someone a dick in the US?

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  57. Swearing is so interesting... they're just syllables but they carry so much weight!

    I'm from New Zealand, so I have an entirely different view. We would use cunt towards a male, not a female, but it is considered pretty bad. We have conflicting views from immigrant americans who think it's the worst word ever and the poms who chuck it around casually. And of course being a former colony we swear liberally.

    TV in the states seems to be so censored! When I watch Skins (british TV show) here it's not bleeped at all, but when I watch it online it's censored for US audiences and every second word is blanked out.

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  58. @anon 4:31 and 16:05...
    Not All Americans use the term "ma'am". In fact it's mostly a southern U.S.A. thing. I personally hate the term because to me it sounds like referring to an old lady. It's actually supposed to be a term of respect but still I don't want to be called that.

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  59. Ma'am is also a word the military uses, with a female officer. As for cunt, if you were to say it at some of the sleaziest settings, even someone who wouldn't be offended would certainly take notice. While fuck is said to be the mother of all cuss words, cunt is the most offensive. As for wanker, in America, if a five year old were to start yelling "wanker wanker wanker wanker!!" after church let out and was marching up and down the pews, the common response would probably be "How cute, he's marching!"

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  60. I maintain the people who are offended by a word like "cunt" or anything else only feel that way because they know they are indeed being cunty (cuntish? cuntesque? cunt-abulous? cuntastic?)

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  61. Also, american tv censors the oddest things. for instance, certain networks will bleep the word asshole, except when they do it, they bleep out the "hole" not the "ass". apparently "hole" is far too dirty of us to think about.

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  62. @ Anonymous 25 September 2010 04:31 - I agree. When I went to California for 2 months, so many people called me ma'am. I was 20! Some of them were younger than me! I only found it offensive because it made me sound like I was ancient.

    In Australia, we've gradually loosened up on swearing. Pretty much, if it's after 8 P.M on TV, you can pretty much guarantee swearing won't be censored.

    Back when I was in highschool, Toyota came out with the "bugger" ad, which automatically meant that every single kid at school was saying it because "it's on tv, so it's not a bad word!"

    I admit, I have used the "c word" to other women, but only when they've been -incredibly- rude and hateful towards me. Once I called a lady who'd been harassing me for months a "miserable c-" and she burst into tears. Granted, she was American, but still.

    I don't really like using the word because it seems like that word is just harsh, moreso than others. It has the hard K sound at the start, and it's a very short, abrupt word. The sound of the word is harsh in itself, and I think that's what makes the word sound so much worse than others.

    My youngest aunt, who has 2 children below 4th grade, says "Sugar honey ice tea" when she wants to swear about something in front of them (take the first letter of each word =P) And she often says "Firetruck" too.

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  63. hahaha. Personally, I find nothing wrong with cussing. They're just words in people's vocabulary, and I use them frequently. I live on the east coast of the US, and my mother absolutely HATES the c-word.
    The only time I've ever heard the c-word was either when watching british television/movies or when it came out of my own mouth.

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  64. Jaw-dropper it is.

    @griffinrose My friend heard stories of Hanukkah Hal when she was a kid.

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  65. why havent you posted in a while?

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  66. I think STM is channeling Kevin Bloody Wilson:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElPs9NLZoUY

    Also, the c-word is increasingly broadcast uncensored on British TV. In fact, there's a joyous episode of The Thick Of It which is pretty much based around it:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iiks6TRd_Wo&playnext=1&list=PL0312AFB033514A99&index=4#t=9m54s

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  67. I think the only thing worse than being called a cunt is being called a dirty cunt...

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  68. i feel sorry for you karen, you must never get a good nights sleep

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  69. I'm just catching up with this... (yes, i'm slow!)

    I've always found it funny that when trying to take the edge off "bloody hell", americans will say "bloody heck" where us brits will say "bleedin' hell".

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